It’s not that I’m being disingenuous. Rather it was writing the post on my first date model that made me examine what I do on a date and it made me spell out my escalation process. Again I have to thank the gentlemen who encouraged me to start this blog.
Since my first date model post I’ve been ensuring that I hit each question on every first date (in a calibrated way, fractionated with small talk and appropriate kino).
The lesson here is that the two date model is a good structure, but calibration trumps structure every time. If you feel that it’s on by all means pull the trigger.
Again I think writing that post helped me be more mindful and systematic regarding what I’ve been doing on first dates, and then with a bit of luck, calibration, and leadership things have gone my way.
I’ve done 7 first dates with new girls in January so far (with 4 more scheduled here in NYC). This is in addition to seeing one of my regulars in Bangkok in early January and two of my regulars in SF mid-month. Here’s the break down of January’s 7 dates so far:
2. (lost) A 23 year old nursing student in SF, solid date but wouldn’t bounce home with me. Trailed off in the after date texting.
3. (closed) A 24 year old nursing student in SF who I bounced home after she was very clearly “on” and had both her legs in my lap.
4. (dropped) A 23 year old New York girl who came out on the coldest day of the year. We had two drinks and it felt like I could bounce her home, but I opted not to since I was cold and not in the mood.
5. (dropped) A 28 year old Costa Rican girl here in NYC. Positive date, I had a date 2 lined up but it was stacked after date 7 below so I cancelled on her when I opted to take date 7 back to my place.
6. (closed) A 23 year old New York girl who flaked on me twice, but then begged me to meet up, and once she showed up turned out to be one of the biggest “yes” girls I’ve ever dated. It just shows that sometimes girls can be random.
7. (closed) A 22 year old native New Yorker who was also a strong click from the beginning. Massive eye contact. I opted to bounce her to two different bars before taking her home (and cancelled on the Costa Rican girl as I did it). Several rounds of wild sex and a very fun date overall.
Every new year’s day I do an annual exercise where I sit and write out all of the positive memories I’ve had from the past year. I don’t let myself look at my calendar and I have to do it all in one go. This accomplishes a couple of things.
First, it’s an annual barometer of how well I’m living my life. If I don’t have at least fifty positive memories from the previous year I’m not living right. Secondly it’s a great reminder of just how amazing life is and it reinforces a positive mental picture of my life’s story.
Today I realized I only just started writing this blog one month ago, thanks to the positive encouragement of Pancake Mouse, the Red Quest, and Nash. They have definitely been right.
On the one hand the last 30 days have felt like business as usual. But taking a moment to look back I realize it’s been a pretty fucking amazing start to the year. This past month I’ve been to two new countries, and slept with five new girls in addition to three of my regulars.
I’ve written 19 posts including some I’m especially proud of such as my first date model and my thoughts on that there is no “end game” for men. In the past few weeks I’ve been in 95 degree tropical heat and now 4 degree freezing cold here in New York and everything in between.
I’m sitting in the San Francisco airport waiting out a weather delay on my flight to NYC. I’ll be staying at an airbnb there for the next three weeks in the my neighborhood of choice.
I’m flying into a snowstorm and not a lot of people would choose to leave a warm winter city like SF to spend three weeks in the snow and cold, especially since I’ve barely gotten over the jetlag from spending three weeks abroad in Cambodia, Thailand, and Malaysia.
But I’m a man on a mission to find a better home base that SF and after all my recent travels the past two years NYC is my leading candidate for now.
The recent trip to Southeast Asia was successful for me since I was able to rule out that region as a place I would enjoy living, despite my success with women there. It’s simply too hot and uncomfortable, and you end up spending all of your time indoors at malls to avoid the heat.
I’ve been all over the US and Western Europe (I lived in London for two years and traveled weekly in Europe and the Middle East for work), and from the hundreds of trips to those cities I can safely say NYC is the only city I enjoy at least as much as my native SF. I’ve been to NY five times, including three times in the last two years, but I’ve never been for more than a week and I’ve never been in the dead of winter.
The purpose of this trip is to put New York to the test. If I enjoy in the dead of winter as much as I have on past trips then I will make the move in August when my lease in SF expires.
Here are the advantages I see with New York over SF:
It’s a bigger city with more to do, and a bigger dating pool.
It has the best male / female ratio of any large city in the US. I’ve experienced this first hand…I got closed three new girls in 5 days during my last trip to NY in May. I’ve also gone on dates (but didn’t close) with working models in NY. These girls simple don’t exist in SF.
NY is the best US city for daygame.
NY has a lot of attractive girls from Eastern Europe which are my favorite. These girls barely exist in SF.
I’ve lived in San Francisco for five years now and frankly it’s feeling a bit too familiar. I’ve got memories on almost every single corner.
NY puts me closer to Eastern Europe, where I will be exploring for alternative home bases over the next few years. I will be in Krakow and Prague in May, with more trips to come.
I work remotely so there is no impact to me professionally, but the timezone will actually make my job easier.
Here are the downsides that I see:
I will have to let go of two of my best regulars of all time, something I’m prepared to do. Nothing lasts forever.
The cost of living is about the same as SF, so I don’t get the improved cash flow that I would if I were to move to just about any other city in the world. I’ll be analyzing the tax impacts this tax season to confirm this.
There may be more tradeoffs I’m not aware of. But this seems like a good tradeoff for me right now. I’ve moved five times within SF in the five years I’ve been divorced as I’ve been experimenting with what works best for me. So this move is a natural extension of the path I’ve been on.
As usual I’ve got a pipeline of five dates scheduled for the first three days I’m there with more to come. I’ll be meeting up with several of my NYC friends while I’m there as well, including for some daygame sessions. It should be a good trip despite the cold.
I had the privilege of being one of the men that the Red Quest asked to provide input on the manuscript for his book, “Sex Clubs, Non-Monogamy, and Game“. He’s finished the book in part with my input and is now giving the book away for free (downloadable at the link).
It’s a unique book based on his years of experience in the sex club / swinger scene in his city. In the first half of the book he covers why a man would want to include sex clubs as part of his game, and in the second half of the book he shares lots of specific examples from his own dating life.
Personally I haven’t had direct experience with sex clubs. I’ve had FFM threesomes, and I once took a 22 year old I was dating to a sex club here in San Francisco. But we left after 10 minutes, the club was slow and frankly we didn’t like the looks of anyone else there. So I was curious to read Red Quest’s take on this scene and how to integrate it into non-monogamous relationship management.
As I’ve written about here and here, it’s your role as a man to lead your woman. Lead her experience and take her to places she’s never been before. Doing this right I’ve been able to keep the attractive women I want in my life, without having to promise monogamy. Women want to be lead by an exciting lover as a means for them to experience the world. And I can see from “Sex Clubs, Non-Monogamy, and Game” that sex clubs could be part of your larger game in doing this leading…if you had the skills and inclination.
After reading this book, here are the positives I see for bringing your girls to sex clubs:
you frame yourself as top tier lover because you’ve opened her to experiences she’s only fantasized about but would never make happen on her own
her attraction for you can increase as she watches you fuck other girls (preselection at its most primal)
you can leverage her for variety both by swapping her with other couples and also having her recruit other girls for you
the sex club scene in your city becomes a long term “ecosystem” / social circle you can leverage for constantly finding new partners – if you have the social savvy and sex skills to be a top-tier guy in the sex club scene in your city
Here are the downsides I see:
I doubt most guys can pull this off – this is advanced level game and your looks, game, and sex skills need to be on point. You need a strong frame and ability to lead
other guys will try and poach your girl
you have to manage not just your relationship with the girl you bring but your relationship with the other couples you play with
most guys won’t enjoy watching “their” girl fuck other guys…even if it means they get to fuck other girls at the same time
From my very limited experience in San Francisco I’m not convinced there are many attractive women in the sex club scene (I’m picky and prefer petite college aged girls)
I think this is a worthwhile read to any one who’s had some curiosity about the sex club world. There’s value here in reading about Red Quest’s advanced level game in action, even if all you’re looking to do is merge girls you’re already dating into a FFM threesome with you.
A lot of men have been talking about end game (RedQuest | Roy Walker | Troy Francis | Krauser / Jimmy Jambone among others). (addition 1/27: Tom Torero weighs in that there is no end game). The question seems to be, “is being a player all there is?” and “what comes after being a player?”. It seems for many that after 5-10 years in the game the rush of getting yet another notch doesn’t do it any more.
I suspect what this ultimately comes down to is that men want pair-bonding. I’m 44 years old and have personally experienced the full range of types of relationships with women, from same day sport fucks to fuck buddies to harems to girlfriends to my marriage (ended 5 years ago).
From this experience I truly believe that sexual pair-bonding with a woman can’t last more than 3-5 years tops, before your relationship degrades into routine without any real spark. This is how nature intended it: pair up long enough to produce offspring and get them into childhood, then rotate to a new partner to diversify your genes. We can’t get around our DNA.
So I’m at peace with being a player forever. As a man you have to be able to bring new women into your life on an ongoing basis, and pair-bond with them as you see fit.
What fits best for me (every man is different) is having 2-4 regular girls at a time in my life, where I see each once a week. In effect this is a portfolio of girls with whom I pair-bond in different ways for as long as the honeymoon period lasts (“sweet spot” might be a better term), in some cases for years and still going.
What I like about this in effect is I’m always in the honeymoon phase, even as girls eventually come and go. It’s on you as the man to manage these relationships properly and keep them fresh.
With hedonic adaptation our brains gets used to routine. I attribute a portion of my satisfaction with this lifestyle to the fact that I never let these mini relationships get routine. I vary up where we go, what we do, how we fuck every single time. How we lead the dance makes a difference in getting more satisfaction and longevity out of these relationships while they last.
None of these relationships will last “forever” because nothing in life lasts forever. There is no end to this process, just like there is no end to exercise and good nutrition. It’s a part of a healthy life and supports you in your higher mission, whatever that is for you.
This is why we have to constantly game and constantly build value as men. We are not meant to rest in life. We’re meant to strive till we die.
With that set up how could I refuse? For better or worse, here’s my dating model that I prefer. I know men like Nash and Pancake Mouse have different styles. As the strong silent type, this is what works for me. I went on dates with 157 different girls in 2017+2018 and you can see my results here (I closed 61% of these girls that I chose to pursue).
I primarily date from online game. I find it more efficient here in San Francisco than I find daygame, and it allows me to number farm during the day while I’m working and then reserve evenings for the actual dates. This may be an extension of good looking guy game, but I have really good pictures so I find in SF the quality is about the same between online and daygame as well.
I default to a two date model. The first date is usually an hour or so at a nice bar convenient to my place. The second date is dinner at my place (or if she rejects this another drink at another bar nearby).
Since usually the first date is the first time I’m seeing the girl in person, it helps me screen if I really want to go any further with her (of the 157 girls I met up with in 2017+2018 I choose not to pursue 85 of them). I’ll end the date quickly if I’m not in to her with no remorse.
I find the more attracted I am to a girl the more she feels this and reflects it back to me. Girls can feel when you’re not that in to them but trying to fuck them because she just happens to be there.
There are plenty of times when I feel that “it’s on” and so opt to pull the trigger to bounce her to my place on the first date. I don’t plan on it, but it happened for 10% of the girls I opted to pursue, including the Malaysian girl last week.
The two date model has the advantage of reducing the ASD you’ll get verses trying to push for the lay on the first date. I find with my approach although it usually takes two dates to seal the deal, I end up spending less face time with her than it would take to bounce to multiple date venues and also bust through ASD like you often have to in order to get the first date lay.
Mystery said it takes about 7 hours of face time to close a girl, but with a two date model I find it’s often more like 2-3 hours if you do it right. This is because the vacuum between the two dates does some of the work for you. What can I say I’m all about efficiency.
I could write pages on how to do a first date, but a few key points come to mind:
Make her hug you when you meet, start talking to her like you already know her.
Ignore her beauty. I’ve always been good at this naturally, go on a lot of dates so you don’t give a fuck about closing any one particular girl. She needs to feel this.
She will mirror your frame. If you’re attracted it should raise your vibe and she will feel it and it will raise her attraction.
Tease her within the first 20 seconds of meeting – I like to make a playful observation about what she’s wearing.
She may be a bit challenging in the beginning. Usually not shit tests but challenging. Shrug it off and tease / challenge her as appropriate, with your confident masculine vibe. She’ll start to fall under your frame and the rest is downhill from there.
Be sure to sit side by side at a bar or couch so you can kino.
Lead the conversation but ensure she does 70-80% of the talking. Do this by mostly asking questions.
Lean back and be relaxed. Your body language should be confident. The most important thing is your eyes. Make strong eye contact, but at times also look away. You can seduce a woman who doesn’t speak your language purely with body language and eye contact, as I did in Thailand.
For the first 10 minutes do mostly get to know you chit-chat with the occasional tease. This part may need to be higher energy on your part to get things going. You should already start to kino her by touching her hand, or evening interrupting what she says to touch and make a comment about her jewelry. Touch her elbow, knee, etc to emphasize points.
About 10 minutes in start to work in verbal escalations. Fractionate between escalations and normal get to know you chit chat about her family and aspirations. Calibrate how far you push this based on her responses and body langauge. These are questions like:
What’s your guilty pleasure?
What kind of guys do you like?
When was your last significant relationship? What was the sex like?
How do you prefer to cum?
(towards the end) what do you like about me?
As appropriate throw in the occasional (20% of talking) DHV story
Continue to escalate the kino and intensity of eye contact.
Make comments to show you are “woke” and get the “secret society”. My go to comment is how “it’s a double standard that women get judged and it’s wrong. We’re all sexual beings, and it’s a shame society makes women hide it.” This goes a long way to letting them get comfortable with you as the “lover” instead of a beta “provider”.
Be the one to end the conversation around the hour mark. You’re a man in demand and have to go.
She should come away from this first date feeling good from the talking, the kino, and the fractionation of conversation topics. But also wondering if she’s going to see you again because you ended it.
If you do want to see her again text her the next day and pitch date 2 at your place. If you do date 1 right she should happily agree to it, and sex is highly likely. Because you built this bubble with her and then vacuumed for 24 hours or so after before texting her again, she feels your value and is more eager to close the deal. With this two date model you can lose girls if it takes too long between date 1 and date 2, but you also don’t get much ASD on the date 2’s at your place.
I never go for a kiss on the first date because I have found it raises ASD for date 2. The little hamster in her girl brain can justify coming over to your place by saying, “we haven’t even kissed yet, so we’ll probably just do that”. If you’ve kissed her on date 1, she will understand that you will want more than that on date 2, which raises her ASD and makes it less likely she’ll come over. Kissing her on a date when you’re not going to pull the trigger to go all the way also kills some of your mystery and raises ASD and buyer’s remorse.
That’s what I do in a nutshell. Welcome any and all comments you may have below.